The dilemma between wanting “freedom” (to express oneself however one wishes) and “censorship” (the desire by others to control that expression) is as relevant now as it was during the UK obscenity trials of Lady Chatterley (1960) and Oz (1971). Probably more so given that today’s technology enables pretty much anyone to create and access any type of material that can be imagined. I find myself alternating my own position back and forth!

Just to pick up on a few points:

1/”Children are innocent and pure. To make them otherwise is a degradation to youth as a whole.”

As a bald statement this is simply not true however much adults may want it to be so, and most likely never has been. Examples? Too many in fiction and in real life e.g.

* Lolita (Nabokov’s notorious novel, already mentioned above by Sere)
* Edlington brothers 2009 (horrific torture and sexual abuse of two young boys by two brothers aged 10 and 12)
* Jamie Bulger 1993 (horrific torture, sexual abuse and murder of a toddler by two 10 year old boys)
* “Future footballer’s wife” T-shirts and padded bras marketed at and worn by pre-teen girls (what are these companies thinking? Oh how stupid of me, capitalism means making money wherever you see a business opportunity without having to worry about pesky inconveniences like morality. Sorry, I’ve wandered off topic here).

2/Dominick, you finger “bad parenting” as an underlying issue and Rose adds “Parents need to limit and monitor their children’s use of the internet.” This is a whole subject in itself and in this context the failure by many (most?) parents to put in place appropriate controls on access to and use of technology by their children seems to be key (because they don’t understand the technology? haven’t got time to do anything?).

3/”Young teens do not have the maturity to know for certain they are ready for sex, which is why they have statutes for the ages of consent. Some 14 year olds still have trouble picking out what cereal they want in the morning let alone who they want to sleep with.”

It’s interesting how views on sexual matters are so often held by reference only to current social mores as if they are “set in stone” for all of humanity and for all time. But this is not so and never has been as history and other cultures confirm, for example:
* historically it was common to be married at, say, 12 (Shakespeare’s Juliet was just 13)
* in many countries it’s currently legal to have sex at 14 – all permutations! (e.g. China, many parts of Europe and in at least 3 USA states!)
* Jerry Lee Lewis married a 13 year old legally in the USA
* Elvis Presley fell in love with a 14 year old
* likewise Don Johnson (he later married her)
* some cultures had (still have?) sexual “rites of passage” at puberty in order to “become a man” that would be considered disgusting, perverted and criminal by reference to present “Western” customs, values and laws – but these societies functioned happily – who are we to condemn them? – what right do we have to impose on them our Western values as “cultural imperialists”?

4/”I believe it is proper, even in parody, to ask the original author for permission to parody their work … It’s an issue of respect for the original creator.”

Disagree. Some “original creators” deserve no respect and are rightful targets for non-consensual parody e.g. much of the execrable output of Hollywood and US TV.

5/”That is also why it’s not illegal to draw Hermione porn or to Photoshop an underage Emma Watson’s head onto porn, because it’s not real. If it was actual underage Emma Watson porn, it would be child porn but it’s fake so it’s legal.”

Warning: this may not be illegal in good ole’ USA but it most definitely is a criminal offence in the UK – you’ll be sent to prison if you do this and be put on the Sex Offender’s Register.

And about fan fic being theft of the original authors idea and being totally uncreative, allow me to introduce you to http://www.jamespotterseries.com/muggle_index.html . They are entire books of fan fiction. Read the intro. If that is someone just ripping off JKR then I am a flying turtle. The guy wrote entire books. It wasn’t just how much he wrote that is incredible. He specifically designed the books to seem as if they were written by JKR. If he were to publish them, they would sell even if Harry Potter didn’t exist and this was written entirely by itself. So yeah, fan fic isn’t disrespecting the author. Erotic fan fic is disrespectful but just because they are turning the characters into sex objects. You see, most fan fic is written because people don’t want the series to end. The reason I read fan fic is because I love Harry potter and this is the only way I can keep it going. JKR probably won’t write more books so this is all thats left to us. And most people write it because either they weren’t satisfied with some points of the story or because they wanted to improve on something OR because they wanted to keep the story going. So while I hare Hermione and Draco shippers, I this thatits a good thing that they’ve written 5 billions fan fics about it.

Oh and check this out. Go on YouTube and search for A Very Potter Musical and watch it. Thats an entire musical based off Harry potter. And there’s a sequel. And they’re better than any of the movies were.

I began reading the HP series when I was 11. In between books, I discovered FF and it kept me sated until the next real installment. I wonder what you are googling to say that 95% of FF is smut. When I was younger and searching for FF, I never encountered NC-17 rated fics, only mild, age-appropriate ones. That isn’t to say once I looked I didn’t find them.

Now, my opinion of adult fics based on the Harry Potter series may be skewed. I’m just a few years older than the actors in the movies, so to me when I was reading the mature fics, I was pretty much the same age as those involved. Ask me in five years or so how I feel about it. For instance, I remember thinking Tom Felton was very hot when I saw the first movie, and now when I rewatch I just think “Awww, how adorable.” Same now, the older version of the same boy is still pretty damn attractive. In a few years I’m sure I’ll just have the same “Awww” reaction.

And really…why do you keep bringing up the Harry/Owl thing? I have NEVER come across anything that strange (nor have I looked) and for someone who is so outspoken about these situations being inappropriate, why are you looking for them? Yes, people write about strange things. It is one of the internet rules: If it exists, there is porn of it. So be it. Not my thing, but someone else may like it. To each their own. These adult fics are written for adults. Granted there is no surefire way of keeping young eyes from finding it, but it they are old enough to know what to look for, and understand what they are reading…well, I surely don’t blame it on the parents. Nearly all I knew about sex from a young age came from my best friend’s older brothers. At a young age we knew about it, and had enough sense to know we weren’t ready to actually DO it. That didn’t mean we were not still curious, so we wrote mild adult-themed fics. It was fun and exciting and something to let out all that lovely sexual fristration being a teen causes without actually submitting our bodies to the same acts.

I agree that if an author wishes for their works to be left alone, then websites shouldn’t let people post it. If you simply MUST write a fic, keep it in a journal. You still get the satisfaction of writing, but you are respecting the author’s wishes.

I myself started writing by writing fanfic. It fueled a previously unrealized passion I had, and encouraged me to write my own stories. When I first began wiring, it was horrid. However, I feel that the aforemention Neil Gaiman quote describes how I view fanfic quite well. Writing fanfic helped me better my writing, which to me, means the world. If using another person’s characters to better yourself is wrong, then I’m guilty as charged. I have never posted a fanfic on any site. I write on my own computer for my enjoyment only.

If I were a published author, I would be honored to have fanfic written about my characters. To see where people think they should go with their stories after I was finished with them. Whether it be a neutral, G fic, or a steamy smut fic with bizarre pairings, I would still be touched that someone enjoyed my creations enough to give them new life. For once the words leave your pen, they belong to the world. Now, with that being said, I would not condone child abuse or beastiality and such, but one cannot keep that from happening. And like previous posters have mentioned before, writing something and doing something or even feeling the same way is not the same thing. One could write a detailed sex scene and still be a virgin. Or write about bondage, but in reality be appalled by it. What the characters do and feel is not the same as what the author does and feels, fanfic or not.

You have a right to your opinion, and I am not trying to sway that. However, my opinion is that you are a prat.

Mischief managed.

First, I agree that it is wrong to write about sex involving minors. I would never want to read about 13 year old Harry and hundred and something Dumbledore getting it on. Or someone having sex with an animal. In my own opinion, that is gross.

But, I don’t know what sites you are visiting that you think 95% of all fanfiction has sex. There are soo many more that simply deal with life, family, friends, relationships, jobs, etc. They can be cute, sweet, uncomplicated, or even drama filled. Regardless of what you seem to think, some of us do not use fanfiction simply as a way to write porn.

On that note, I find it hilarious that you seem to think that characters make up the entire story. Who cares about the actual plot, the backbone of the story, what actually happens to the characters, that is unimportant, right? I get that you think we are stealing someone else’s characters. And it is less creative to use preexisting ones than think up others. But the plot of those stories (hopefully) is ORIGINAL. (Mostly, I will admit. Some do steal the plot of another movie/book/etc.) That is the point of fanfiction. To put the characters that we have spent hours and hours caring for, growing to love, laughing with, into different situations. We cannot bear to let them disappear, do not wish their story to end simply with the conclusion of the book. Many times, I will find my mind straying into a random story, and I think, hey, this character would go great in this plot. Please, do not sit there and call what I have slaved over writing, editing, and rewriting uncreative.

You can not like fanfiction, many people don’t. That is ok. Don’t read it and please do not insult the people who do like it.

I personally am against fan fic (adult or not) because I find it unoriginal and disrespectful to the author. You like being disrespectful and hide under the guise of, “I’m honoring their work”. This was not what my original article was about – it was about adult fan fiction and underage characters. However, some authors do not mind fan fic, when it’s clean, so therefore, it’s not my work, and not my say. Still, I have never heard an author say they are for adult fan fic (in fact, JK has stated she is AGAINST it – her characters aren’t meant to be the sex objects of some wannabe author’s fantasy writing), especially when it concerns underage characters in any form. That is bordering on illegal.

Further, I don’t care if you knew about sex when you were 10 (or any other age). You should not have been reading or writing such fan fic. That just speaks of bad parenting on the part of your parents. Believe me, my teenage son has never read or written such things nor would he be interested in reading stories about children in this manner once he is of legal age and able to access fan fic of this sort. We talk frankly with him about sex. We let him know it is natural and not to be feared or repressed. However, he also knows he needs to be mature enough to handle sex, and fourth graders ARE NOT that mature. Some 18 year olds are not that mature. I can only wonder what kind of parents you have that they had no idea what kind of smut you were reading/writing on your computer at such a young age.

I can see exploring your sexuality, but why do it with a 13 year old, made up character? Really? If a man was writing about his 13 year old niece or neighbor in the same way, it’d be deemed kiddie porn and he could potentially get arrested for it. He’d be deemed “sick” by anyone and everyone and, at the least, be expected to get help of some sort. Yet, when it’s a 13 year old, but the character is made up, it’s okay? Talk about the hypocrisy!!

I find it hilarious that every one of you have decided your defense is to insult me because I don’t approve of 13 year old Harry doing an owl or an adult professor. I don’t have an active fantasy life? Why? Because I think adult fan fic is trite? I assure you my fantasy life is just fine, but then I don’t have to rip off anyone else’s ideas to come up with all the amazing places my mind has the ability to go.

Next, fanfiction not being creative???? Wow, you probably don’t have much of a fantasy life do you? I find it a lot harder to write in other people’s characters than my own. (Yes, I do write both.) Frankly, Harry Potter going to Hogwarts means I have to write in Harry’s voice and my readers know his voice just as well/if not better than I do but if I write about Greg Litman going to boarding school then I can say anything I want because the fans don’t know him as well as I do. To me that makes original fiction easier than fan.

As for protecting kids from adult fanfiction…OMG I’ve just died laughing. I was writing fanfiction in fourth grade. Yes, some of it was sexual in nature. Why? Because reading and writing it was an acceptable way to explore my sexuality. No one got hurt and at the end of the day I had nothing to regret. More importantly I think this type of exploration allowed me to realize what is very important to me and also help me to save myself for marriage (Yeah that’s right I’m 25 and a virgin and I owe it all to fanfiction.)

So maybe some fanfiction is a bit out there but these people might just be exploring the sexuality in a way that is safe. You telling them they are wrong may only hurt their self exploration process and cause people to repress their desires. We all know what happens with repressed things… (hehe I went to a private school and it is true.)

Finally, I find your arguements slightly predictable. You’ll say something about fanfiction is only wrong if the orginal author is against and some crap about under age and not address any of my actual comments.

I would also have to say 95% of the fan fic I have encountered has been sexual in nature. Essentially, the primary purpose of the story is to get someone’s rocks off, by having the characters have sex. I have NOTHING against sex. I think sex is GREAT, but it seems sad to me that this is how these people get their sexual enjoyment (off other people’s creations). It’s not really a story if the only purpose is to turn literature into porn. Imagine all the great books turned into sex=filled romps with no other real plot; The Three Musketeers, To Kill a Mockingbird, A Farewell to Arms, Lord of the Flies, etc. It kind of ruins the story, don’t you think?

Back to comic book created art, since I went off course for a second. I think art is an entirely different situation when it is not fan created. Look at all the comic book characters written, drawn, and conceived by different artists. The original creators of these characters encouraged other artists to continue their legacy, by developing new incarnations and stories. I am fine with that. But, again fan created art really depends on what the creators of the original characters think, and whether the fan is trying to profit from their borrowed creation.

Further, I’ve pointed out SEVERAL times the problem I have with the sex has to do with YOUNG characters (we are talking 13, 14, 15 year olds having sex with 40, 50, 80 year olds). We don’t let people have underage pics on their computers. Why allow stories about such young characters in pedophile-esque situations? I also find it very creepy to think of 17 or 18 year olds having sex with 80+ year olds. It is different if it consensual. This means those involved are of SOUND mind and legal age. Young teens do not have the maturity to know for certain they are ready for sex, which is why they have statutes for the ages of consent. Some 14 year olds still have trouble picking out what cereal they want in the morning let alone who they want to sleep with.